00:00:06:16 - 00:00:27:03 Speaker 1 Welcome to Waterford fighting. We discussed the past, present and future of water in Florida with the people who make it happen. I'm your host, Brett Cyphers. This episode of Waterford Fighting is brought to you by sea and shoreline. Sea and shoreline is the southeast leading innovator, protecting coastal communities from devastating storms and restoring ecosystems that once faced ecological collapse. 00:00:27:05 - 00:00:49:12 Speaker 1 Visit their website at sea and shoreline.com. If you enjoy the discussions here on Waterford Fighting, then you should definitely be reading the Florida Specifier and listening to the Florida Specifier podcast. The specifiers become Florida's environmental news source of record, and the podcast is your go to place for staying up to speed on environmental news and newsmakers here in the Sunshine State. 00:00:49:14 - 00:01:12:06 Speaker 1 You can join the discussion as we explore the latest environmental news and developments that matter to you. Go to WW dot Florida specifier.com or wherever only the finest of podcast are offered. All right, let's get right to it. My guest today is Toby Oberdorf. For those of you who don't already know, and you should already. But if you don't. 00:01:12:12 - 00:01:37:16 Speaker 1 Toby's a four term member of the Florida House of Representatives, a biologist who's the southeast US and Bahamas right. Director for Hailey Ward. And he and his wonderful wife, Maggie, are newly minted grandparents. Toby, thanks for taking some time away from your election season work, first of all. And I guess much more enjoyable playdates with absolutely grandbaby. Spend some time. 00:01:37:16 - 00:01:38:00 Speaker 1 Thanks. 00:01:38:01 - 00:01:46:04 Speaker 2 Well, thanks for having me. I really appreciate it. Long time listener for for this podcast and obviously a first time participant on this podcast. 00:01:46:04 - 00:02:00:17 Speaker 1 Thank you. I still give credit. So I say this and I think this is your at least I think your fourth time. And usually you were, you know, me and my partner Ryan Matthews and talking. So I think and we are going to come up with like a gold green. I think it's gonna be a blue jacket I guess, for the point. 00:02:00:18 - 00:02:01:13 Speaker 2 For the specifier. 00:02:01:14 - 00:02:05:14 Speaker 1 Yeah. One more, one more appearance and and we're getting you the jacket. Oh. 00:02:05:14 - 00:02:05:18 Speaker 2 Oh. 00:02:05:21 - 00:02:22:01 Speaker 1 All right. It'll be it'll be nice. Maybe. Maybe badge or something like that on it. Anyway, there's a lot to cover that I want to dig into. And usually I like to start the beginning. We do grandparents and your parents and and these sorts of things like. But I want to level set a little bit here with you. 00:02:22:02 - 00:02:39:17 Speaker 1 I'm doing the reading. You know. Yeah. I've got your resume, I've got your bio. I'm looking at the colleges you went to and the places you know, that you were or almost were. I just want to say it's like. Did you intentionally set out to become the Richard Dreyfuss character in jaws? Because it's kind of a really close fit. 00:02:39:17 - 00:02:47:10 Speaker 1 You're the son of a sailor. You studied sharks to the point of swimming with great whites and I, you know, and I figured, you know, the book. 00:02:47:16 - 00:02:48:23 Speaker 2 In and out of the cage. 00:02:49:00 - 00:03:00:08 Speaker 1 Yeah. Well, and and that's that's, you know, that's where I get to, which is the character in the movie lives, the guy in the book. Your character does not. And it's because he gets in that cage. 00:03:00:08 - 00:03:02:03 Speaker 2 Well, that's why I like the movie better. 00:03:02:05 - 00:03:11:23 Speaker 1 Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And, you know, and you live in New England. I mean, there's like a lot of parallels there. So, I mean, you must have seen jaws. I mean, we all did when we were kids. 00:03:12:00 - 00:03:13:07 Speaker 2 Absolutely, yes. 00:03:13:09 - 00:03:17:01 Speaker 1 And you were still at that point like, hey, sharks are really, really awesome. 00:03:17:02 - 00:03:32:22 Speaker 2 Yeah. And even at one point, I was actually a notion lifeguard in Rhode Island, which is right on the sound where the largest to that date, the largest great white had ever been caught. Then soon after it was out of Cuba, believe it or not. But yeah, that was where the largest one had been caught. 00:03:32:23 - 00:03:39:06 Speaker 1 Wow. So anyway, let's get let's get the mom and dad. And where are your folks originally from? 00:03:39:08 - 00:04:01:22 Speaker 2 So dad grew up in Johnstown, Pennsylvania, with the floods and everything else. He was the oldest of three. It was Tom is his middle brother was was Dick. And you can imagine the last guy was it was Dave. But his middle initial, his middle name was Harry. So they grew up there in Johnstown, Pennsylvania. Dad ended up winning a naval ROTC scholarship. 00:04:02:01 - 00:04:25:18 Speaker 2 He was two people out of like 3 or 400 people that took it. He ended up winning it. Wow. And ended up at Penn State University and went from there to be a naval aviator. And he had a long, illustrious career that saw three tours in Vietnam. And then he ended up at the Pentagon, ended up actually winning a Bronze Star for managing the the maintenance on the the Atlantic Fleet. 00:04:25:19 - 00:05:02:07 Speaker 2 We ended up in Massachusetts after that. He was the commander of the ROTC unit up there, had one more transfer in him that he thought he was going to do. And it was 1977, 78 area. So he was either going to go back to the Pentagon. He was. Either there or he was going to Columbia, and he's going to be the military attache in Columbia, which at that time was was interesting considering all of the, shall we say, white trade that was happening back and forth with, with the US or he was the one that he was looking forward to, was actually he has a master's degree in Middle East relations. 00:05:02:10 - 00:05:18:14 Speaker 2 So he was going to be the military attache to a little embassy in Iran. So he was he would if we had gone, we would have been in the middle of the takeover of the hostages, everything else there. And he would have been one of the hostages. And my mom actually was the one who said, hey, you know what? 00:05:18:14 - 00:05:24:09 Speaker 2 We got a pretty good place here in Massachusetts. The kids are happy. We've been moving around a lot. Let's just stay here. So we ended up doing that. 00:05:24:09 - 00:05:29:11 Speaker 1 Wow. At what point did he officially get out of that sort of service? 00:05:29:13 - 00:05:50:00 Speaker 2 1978 is when he. So he didn't. Yeah, he didn't transfer. He had 28 years plus or minus in 29. And then he said, all right, we're going to call it. He could have gone back, obviously, and he would have been selected for Admiral. But he chose to come out as a captain. He's now since passed away, passed before I became a representative. 00:05:50:01 - 00:05:57:10 Speaker 2 And we had a ceremony. He was actually in Arlington now. So whenever I get up to D.C., there's some times that I get over to see him there. 00:05:57:12 - 00:06:05:00 Speaker 1 Nice. My dad's there as well. Beautiful place. Absolutely. Talk about the wiser, apparently, of the two. With your. With your mom. 00:06:05:02 - 00:06:26:07 Speaker 2 So mom is one of two sisters, and she. I grew up in cold in New York, just south of just near Orchard Park, New York. So I spent many, many a summer out there with my grandparents. But she ended up going from there to New York City on a nursing expedition, shall we say, and she became a registered nurse there. 00:06:26:07 - 00:06:46:08 Speaker 2 I met my dad on a on a blind date in On Fire Island, actually, and they ended up getting married shortly thereafter. But she she really came from a, you know, my grandfather was worked in a steel plant as well. And my, my grandmother did all kinds of things, including in the medical field and teaching and all types of stuff like that. 00:06:46:08 - 00:07:07:09 Speaker 2 So they were just down home, real, real good people. And my grandfather was a big influence on me. But mom was still she was still going. She's still giving us her medical advice, and she's also helping all of her neighbors. She lives and lives in Stuart, Florida, and she and her sister are still moving along. So good stuff. 00:07:07:11 - 00:07:13:04 Speaker 1 That's great when you talk about your grandfather and and steel, is that Pennsylvania at that or. 00:07:13:07 - 00:07:32:19 Speaker 2 That's also New York. So outside of Buffalo, New York. And he also worked he worked for Bethlehem Steel too. But he was a crane operator, and he was so good at his job at the time, he was what was called a strategic job. So he actually was never transferred to get into World War Two. He was deemed to be so important at his job. 00:07:32:19 - 00:07:54:23 Speaker 2 They kept him in the States. And and he always felt kind of guilty about that. But at the same time, he was really good at it. So he stayed here. And then he really taught me the basics of conservation, the basics of a lot of the environmental work that I do, and kind of implanted that. So he taught me about hunting as well as conservation, a lot of freshwater fishing. 00:07:54:23 - 00:08:13:11 Speaker 2 And we when my teenage years, my young maybe, you know, tweener years, I guess you call it I was down here in Florida with him a lot and we would we would do fishing on the bridge and getting the shrimp at night and things like that. So it was kind of my first real exposure to the environment and always loved going with him. 00:08:13:12 - 00:08:23:19 Speaker 1 Yeah. Help me connect where like where his his life took him, you know, from New York, you mentioned coming down to Florida for these trips. Were the trips or had he moved down to Florida? 00:08:23:20 - 00:08:43:17 Speaker 2 It was always trips. We had. We had family down here. Aunt Alice was over in Sarasota. She was a trip man. She. So she hated the squirrels. And the squirrels always got into her citrus trees. And she had a pump action 22 rifle that my grandfather gifted to me. But this thing is unbelievable. And she was a really good shot. 00:08:43:17 - 00:09:10:03 Speaker 2 So she would grow those squirrels. Until finally one day my grandfather said, look, there's a lot of houses going up around here. I don't think we can have that anymore. So. So Annie left, got her her rifle taken away. But that being said, I mean, that's where we came down to a lot with Sarasota area. We spent a lot of time in Sanibel, and it was it was a great sojourn to come down to Florida and to to see the marshes, to see the always remember, the citrus smell was just so big. 00:09:10:04 - 00:09:22:01 Speaker 2 And and then occasionally we go from Sarasota over to Orlando. I think we went a couple different times. Disney. But the family wasn't huge on Disney. We were really huge on the beach and kind of just hanging out for a couple of days. 00:09:22:02 - 00:09:36:23 Speaker 1 And I guess that's maybe that's a bit of a foreshadow there, because I'm always trying to figure out what's the point at which somebody decides, you know, the thing that they're going to do next. And, and it seems like you already had a pretty good premiere for what Florida was like and what made it special even when you were a kid. 00:09:36:23 - 00:10:02:14 Speaker 2 So we did. Both my sister and I liked it at the time. She was much more of a mountain person now. However, I've always enjoyed being around the water, being in in larger open areas, if you will, and and Florida certainly presents that now as, as it did then, you know, we we also did a lot of time we spent on Cape Cod and Cape Cod was a major marine estuary that where we would go to and Falmouth area. 00:10:02:18 - 00:10:24:14 Speaker 2 And I just remember so many times I would go and hike up into the marsh and wait for the tide to turn, and then snorkel down with the tide out back over, back home, basically. And that was kind of a neat thing. You never knew it was coming around the corner or what was going to be there. And every now and then you'd, you'd find a lobster or a blue crab or something or other and just put a stick in the ground and kind of hold on and try to grab at the same time. 00:10:24:14 - 00:10:44:23 Speaker 2 So it was it was a great childhood growing up there. I got to know some folks that were marine scientists. Actually, the Petersons and Judy Peterson worked at Woods Hole Oceanographic Institute and kind of my first exposure to that whole industry and like, wow, I can I can actually be a scientist and get paid for this and get paid for enjoying what I'm doing here. 00:10:44:23 - 00:10:45:14 Speaker 2 So at. 00:10:45:14 - 00:10:49:07 Speaker 1 What point did you meet, did you get to know her and that? 00:10:49:08 - 00:11:09:17 Speaker 2 And so David Peterson, her son, was a childhood friend and we knew each other. I mean, he was one of my first good buddies. I remember the Blizzard of 78 in Massachusetts, and I had snow up over my head at the time, and we were constructing snow forts and doing all that kind of stuff. And David and I were good friends for quite some time until he moved to Worcester. 00:11:09:22 - 00:11:19:23 Speaker 2 And his dad was a was a big scientist as well, that a lot of chemical research, chemical engineering research and things. So that really gave me a really good exposure to science at that time. 00:11:20:02 - 00:11:29:20 Speaker 1 Go back to connect the dots for me there. So and, you know, my father was the same way he was. I guess we called them Army brats. Is it Navy baby, an Army brat or is it Navy brat to. 00:11:29:22 - 00:11:30:17 Speaker 2 Navy baby? 00:11:30:19 - 00:11:52:19 Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah. So my dad was born in Providence as well as father was his father. My dad was a navy as well, but his father was stationed there. How much did. And you? He was still in the Navy when you. At different points in your kid. So you moved around a bit. All of those places. I mean, are obviously, you know, almost every Navy bases next to the water somewhere, San Diego or Puerto Rico or Pensacola even. 00:11:52:20 - 00:12:06:02 Speaker 1 How much did were you afforded the opportunity to explore some of some of those places, you know, as you moved around? Was that kind of a place where you're able to kind of find yourself a little bit, you know, I would have. 00:12:06:02 - 00:12:27:03 Speaker 2 Loved to accept I was a little bit too young. So when I, I let was born in Newport, Rhode Island, and then left there basically at six weeks old and I was transferred out to Coronado, we had a great home in Coronado, three, three houses down from the hotel del Coronado. I mean, my mom still kicks herself because she had a chance to buy it, but anyway, loved it there. 00:12:27:05 - 00:12:46:17 Speaker 2 I don't remember heck of a lot of it, as you can imagine. I left there at just a little over two years old. Dad was over in Vietnam at the time, and for safety sake, we actually went and live with my grandparents and cold in New York. And then after that it was down to Washington DC and then back up to Massachusetts. 00:12:46:17 - 00:13:11:07 Speaker 2 From there, my sister had a couple more transfers. She's four years old than I am, but so no, I didn't really get the exposure there, but I certainly got the exposure through family pursuits. I mean, the other thing that I didn't tell you about was our family for, gosh, 8 or 9 years, the first week of August of every year, we ended up in Lincoln Bay, Maine, which is near Bar Harbor at a sailing camp there. 00:13:11:12 - 00:13:27:17 Speaker 2 So we're on the ocean, and that's where dad would, you know, let down his hair a little bit. What hair he had. And, it was he'd have his stories out, talk with his Navy buddies, talk with the other people that came with us. So we had a great time there. And it was kind of a a family setting. 00:13:27:18 - 00:13:45:20 Speaker 2 And I learned how to sail there, learn how to water ski. And it was, again, one of those times, you're in, I'm out on the water, on the ocean. So yes, it seems like almost everywhere I went for either vacations or time, it was it was coastal, it was beaches. It was something that was near the water riverine system. 00:13:45:21 - 00:14:01:22 Speaker 1 Talk to your talk about yourself as, as a young kid, a student. What were your first memories in, in school. The kinds of things that, that made you curious. Was it the environmental the water, water things the entire time or is there something else there as well? 00:14:02:02 - 00:14:20:01 Speaker 2 Obviously you go through first, second, third grade. You learn the basics of, you know, just, how do you write in math? And math was always intriguing to me. I absolutely loved it. Had had a great time with that and with numbers. My dad had always challenged me doing math in my head, and I still do do a lot of that, but. 00:14:20:03 - 00:14:40:04 Speaker 2 Mrs.. Mrs.. Barbara Fonseca, in my fourth grade class, she really challenged me with science, and we had our first kind of science fair there, and that was where I think I really started down that path of, oh my gosh, I really enjoy science and continued to to go down and follow that as we went through science fairs and all that. 00:14:40:04 - 00:14:47:15 Speaker 2 It was just something that I really enjoyed, and I wanted to be more of a of a scientist than anything else. 00:14:47:17 - 00:14:48:19 Speaker 1 Were you a good student? 00:14:48:23 - 00:15:12:11 Speaker 2 I was, I was pretty good. Yeah. I mean, I did pretty well. I was in public school from first through ninth grade. My sister had always been in private school, and I didn't have any issues in public school, but I ended up taking a scholarship test to Worcester Academy in Worcester, Massachusetts, and ended up doing the best of all the participants and won a scholarship to to Worcester Academy as a result. 00:15:12:11 - 00:15:36:01 Speaker 2 So I did my final three years there and had some, you know, long lasting friendships, some of my my buddies from there. I still always talk to and have have some good times with them, but I think that really afforded me a great opportunity then to go on to a good school at Union College. I actually had an acceptance letter from Amherst, and I was like, I don't think I really like Amherst and ended up at Union instead. 00:15:36:01 - 00:15:54:08 Speaker 2 And sometimes you go back and kick yourself, but you know, God has plans for you. And and union was where I was going to end up. And I had some great professors there. There was a gentleman named Doctor Carl George. And I always remember he said, you know, Toby, you can't really tell students necessarily by what they know, but you can tell a student by the questions that they ask. 00:15:54:14 - 00:16:25:07 Speaker 2 And he was a great mentor to me, really did my first major scientific research with him, and where we did a study on the migration of seagulls, believe it or not, and inland gulls that would go from start their morning from a water supply reservoir in upstate New York. And they would they would traverse around between Schenectady, Troy and Albany, and they would go into the trash dumps and spend a lot of time foraging the trash dump. 00:16:25:07 - 00:16:44:22 Speaker 2 Then we'd track their migration from the trash dump back to the water reservoir. And we had there had been a couple of different studies that proved that they could carry cholera. They could carry other things like that. So we then proved also that they had to make sure that the reservoirs were treating their water. And it was an interesting study, and I'll always remember that. 00:16:44:22 - 00:16:55:00 Speaker 2 And being able to really assimilate the data and show the different things there. And that was kind of the first real exposure I had to a concrete scientific project. 00:16:55:02 - 00:17:16:23 Speaker 1 You know, and I guess I would put an extra vote for Union College. You know, I did got, you know, as I do, which is like it's always interesting to me. It's like when somebody goes to somewhere other than, you know, Florida for state or Miami, you have some for you in there. So which is great. Florida College is like, but Union is the second college in the state of New York, period, like in the 17. 00:17:17:01 - 00:17:17:22 Speaker 2 1783. 00:17:18:03 - 00:17:29:00 Speaker 1 Right. And it also boasts two former presidents. I think there were about 150 years apart, Chester Arthur. That's right. And and didn't I think it was Jimmy Carter. Is that the other one. 00:17:29:06 - 00:17:37:01 Speaker 2 He went through there? But I don't know if the school claims him still. Yeah. Very good. But they've, they they may now. I'm not sure. Yes. 00:17:37:02 - 00:17:57:14 Speaker 1 Any reason? I mean, I thought it was a, you know, a an interesting place to choose, you know, to go to school and, and so I wonder, like, obviously with Doctor George, you know, at, you know, at the, the business end of it, it's like what drew you to it. What I mean, what was the decision making process, you know, in the end of like, hey, this is the place where I think I, I belong. 00:17:57:17 - 00:18:21:12 Speaker 2 For Union. Honestly, I really wasn't sure what I wanted to do coming out of high school. It was either engineering or medical or something else, and it turned out to be something else at the end of it. I new coming out of Union, I then was able to get into. I was looking at doing the marine sciences. However, going into it, I really thought I was going to be in the engineering side, to be honest with you. 00:18:21:16 - 00:18:29:15 Speaker 2 Ironically, I'm now, you know, part of an engineering company. But that being said, it was it was something that that's the decision that was made for, for Union College. 00:18:29:16 - 00:18:30:03 Speaker 1 Okay. 00:18:30:09 - 00:18:33:19 Speaker 2 And it was far enough away from home. My parents didn't surprise me either. 00:18:33:21 - 00:18:41:16 Speaker 1 Here you go. Tell me about the Sea Education Association and the opportunity that you had there on that big giant boat. 00:18:41:17 - 00:19:09:18 Speaker 2 It was a I mean, this is a great opportunity for anybody out there listening still. I mean, I believe SCA is still going. They have they were based at the time on Cape Cod outside of Woods Hole. And so we would do six weeks of instructional learning within classrooms. Everything else learning from marine navigation to the basics of marine science, understanding what your you would be doing a project then when you got on on the vessel and then learning the basics of seamanship, knots and things like that. 00:19:09:20 - 00:19:34:03 Speaker 2 So after that six weeks, then you spend another 6 to 10 weeks on a cruise, and this one happened to be on 165ft brigantine schooner called the core, with Cramer and steel hulled ship. I mean, this thing was absolutely fantastic. You learned that it's not a rope, it's a line. And you and I learned every sail on this thing knew how to set the fishermen and and all that type of stuff. 00:19:34:03 - 00:19:51:21 Speaker 2 And it was it was absolutely a great experience. And being able to climb the rigging and get up there at any time and feel really comfortable in doing that. And then they would. So you learned how to not only maneuver and drive the boat, you learned how to do it from a using stars and navigational systems in that way. 00:19:51:22 - 00:20:09:05 Speaker 2 So we weren't able to the captain could certainly use the the GPS system and all that, but we weren't allowed to. We had we were in charge of the watch and all that. But then we also had scientific watch. And so we were taking samples. We were doing new stone toes, we were deep water samples, all this type of stuff. 00:20:09:05 - 00:20:29:22 Speaker 2 And in the meantime, you're in this environment going we went from Miami to Colombia, over to Honduras. And when I say Colombia, I mean island off of Columbia called San Andreas. And then we went to Roatan and this is Roatan pre cruise terminals. So it was I mean I had literally the most amazing dive of my life on, on Roatan. 00:20:29:22 - 00:20:46:06 Speaker 2 And it was just an I would go back there in a heartbeat just to try to recreate that. But it was, it was great. And we were in the middle of nowhere doing a deep water sample and tapping on the line here and there, and all of a sudden these big old bull dolphin come up around, around the line. 00:20:46:06 - 00:21:01:19 Speaker 2 We we were able to snag them and had the best sashimi that you could think of right away. And it was it was one of those things. And the other day I remember I had just finished watch and I was going down below, it's a steel hulled boat and I'm taking my shower, by the way, a saltwater shower. 00:21:02:00 - 00:21:25:00 Speaker 2 And all of a sudden I hear these high pitched items going off around just clicking and high pitched and clicking. I'm like, oh my gosh, you know what it is? And I hear up on top of the deck, like everyone's screaming and happened hooting and hollering and the sun had gone down. The moon was just rising. And I got out there in my shorts and I'm looking out and it's like a Disney movie. 00:21:25:00 - 00:21:44:05 Speaker 2 I swear to goodness, the effervescence is going off as as as the dolphin are now shooting out of the waves here and there and everywhere we have this massive pod of dolphin around us. We're cruising through this. There's the moon's just coming up. I mean, you couldn't have written a better script. It was. It was one of those amazing memories I will always have. 00:21:44:11 - 00:22:03:04 Speaker 2 So. And then. Then just one other day, I happened to be in the rigging. I saw a spout go off and I felt like, oh my God, I'm a whaler. And sure enough, these, these minks came along and no fin whales. Excuse me, these fin whales came along. We're in 165ft brigantine schooner. And these mammals are as big as we are. 00:22:03:06 - 00:22:20:14 Speaker 2 It I've never seen since a pod like this. It was one of the coolest things I've ever seen. How we think. We had about eight of them around us at that time. They just cruise with us for a little while and then they were just gone. So it was neat. But that obviously that makes a big impact in your life when you see things like this. 00:22:20:19 - 00:22:26:16 Speaker 2 And so I will always thank the association for what they did and how they do it. 00:22:26:18 - 00:22:51:03 Speaker 1 Can I ask from a practical standpoint, and this is a conversation I've had recently with some folks in Jacksonville over biology students, folks that are that mean to do, you know, whether it be biology, marine biology, zoology, things like this. But they have no real practical experience in all of the things that you you know, you run a business and you have employees. 00:22:51:05 - 00:23:21:23 Speaker 1 And that requires often understanding how to operate a marine craft, understanding how to tie knots. You know, you know, you know, troubleshoot engines, things like that. Is that something that you think is missing here? Is that a is that a gap that could be filled, I wonder? I mean, it seems like such an amazing program. Yeah. I'm always just curious about like how things like that, you know, can have a practical application in terms of turning these, you know, these young students into, into actual serviceable, you know, members of. 00:23:22:01 - 00:23:47:08 Speaker 2 That experience was definitely one of the items that I put on my resume in talking about the research that I did, being able to operate this vessel, I was had the honor of bringing that vessel into the Port of Miami under full sail. Captain just sat back and watched me do it. And so to have that experience, but also the confidence to be able to do it, that is something I think that these programs can instill in young people and then be able to market that as well. 00:23:47:14 - 00:24:01:01 Speaker 2 That's something that we have to get better at as as professionals. And if we're going to be doing this or as students, you need to realize, hey, I can do this. And this is a real positive thing that I have a leg up on other people. 00:24:01:04 - 00:24:25:03 Speaker 1 Yeah, that sounds like it. Talk about some of your your early professional work. I mean, you've done, you know, 35 years of experience at this point in, in the environmental field. Talk about some of that early experience, even if it kind of coincides with some of the research, I think in the middle of that, you know, as I'm as I'm going through, you know, your life on paper is there's an overlap where you decide, okay, I'm, I'm working. 00:24:25:03 - 00:24:38:18 Speaker 1 But I also want to, you know, explore, you know, a graduate degree and I want to be an entrepreneur, you know, so walk me through your thought process in those early years that led you kind of into that entrepreneurial phase of, of. 00:24:38:18 - 00:25:02:21 Speaker 2 Your life? I had had left school, and then I was trying to break into Woods Hole Oceanographic, and I just couldn't. So I ended up I was doing cold killing for for stocks through Merrill Lynch. And I apologize to anybody that I tried to call and sell some stocks to. I was also a bartender and bouncer for a while, and playing Damn musical baseball on Cape Cod had a great time, but I just wasn't wasn't breaking into anything professional. 00:25:02:21 - 00:25:20:16 Speaker 2 I knew it. A friend of mine calls me and says, hey, there's an internship position at Newfound Harbor Marine Institute on Big Pine, which is also known as Sea Camp. And I said, yes. I didn't even know what it was. I said, yes, absolutely. So I got to Florida the day after Hurricane Andrew and got to Big Pine. 00:25:20:16 - 00:25:46:02 Speaker 2 I literally drove through homestead the day after, and it was I was amazed that I got through there without a flat tire and was able to get through it all. But that being said, started there in the keys and absolutely loved the job because I was able to be in the marine environment all the time. I was looking at things, I learned about mangroves, learned about the nearshore environment, the offshore environment, all, and how that interacts. 00:25:46:04 - 00:25:59:20 Speaker 2 So that continued to fascinate me. But of course, you know, a good job, a good weekend in Key West and all of a sudden your wages are gone. That's right. Which was fun. But at the same time, it wasn't the way to start a family. And I knew that. I knew I wanted to start, if you will, quote unquote grow up a little bit. 00:25:59:21 - 00:26:22:00 Speaker 2 And so I found out about a position at Florida Atlantic University with Doctor Walt Courtney and Doctor Salmon there. And it was a position was a cooperative research position where I would work with the water management district doing research on the Kissimmee River and the prior to restoration, and then also was a teaching assistant with Florida Atlantic University. 00:26:22:02 - 00:26:41:16 Speaker 2 So it was a best of both worlds. And throw in on that, because I wanted to make some extra money and ended up working at at a law firm in Boca Raton that does a lot of land use law. So now I'm balancing research with teaching with now land use law and permitting. So it's kind of my first exposure to all of that. 00:26:41:18 - 00:27:11:23 Speaker 2 Who knew that I'd be doing all of that as a professional later? Yet all of those things were melding together to start shaping who I was and what was going on. Well, getting into the water management district and understanding the different levels of of personnel, there was a was a great mentor. Joe Coble, now Doctor Arrington and I got to work with all of them great stories with Joe and Oliver out on the on the floodplains and basically understanding what kind of fish were out there. 00:27:12:01 - 00:27:30:22 Speaker 2 I think we documented the first walking catfish that was in the middle of the, the Kissimmee. And so the Kissimmee floodplain, it was just amazing what we did back then. Then coming out of that, though, I put all this whole thesis together and had a great resume that one of the guys at the law firm helped me out with. 00:27:31:00 - 00:27:48:09 Speaker 2 I ended up coming out of Florida Atlantic University with. I sent out five resumes. I think I got three job offers, and one of them was back at the water district and a couple were in private consulting and was just going to be getting married at the time, my first marriage. And and so I said, I'm going to go with the one with the highest paying. 00:27:48:09 - 00:28:07:17 Speaker 2 And it was a consulting job. So and that's how I ended up in, in Stuart, Florida, and really where I worked for Kim Horne at the time, had a great first opportunity there and understood, though, that there was a also good opportunity and kind of took a bet on myself. And a couple of years later was working with a gentleman and said, all right, it's time for me to go on my own. 00:28:07:17 - 00:28:23:02 Speaker 2 So I was now married to Maggie, and she had all the confidence in the world to me. And so we started a little company called Crossroads Environmental. And literally we were in a desk, kind of like how we are across from each other. Just two of us started this company, and we were able to grow it and grow it and grow it. 00:28:23:02 - 00:28:33:21 Speaker 2 And now, you know, I've gone from crossroads of mental to we're then with EDC and now with Hailey Ward and part of a 300 plus employees. Now. 00:28:33:23 - 00:28:40:02 Speaker 1 Was there something else that you found? I want to say there was something interesting had to do with the pine beetles or something like that, that you that you worked on as well. 00:28:40:03 - 00:29:01:18 Speaker 2 Sure. Well, as, as, you know, the entrepreneurial spirit, we I had gone through a process we're looking at. I did a lot of work golf courses and still do. The Floridian here in, in Palm City was one of my first golf course projects, but worked on MacArthur and worked on all these kind of high end courses. Well, during that time there were some windstorms and various hurricanes, as we often have here in the state of Florida. 00:29:01:22 - 00:29:29:13 Speaker 2 The pine trees would come under stress and pine boards would find these trees often. Well, we started wonder. All right. Is there a way that we could possibly mitigate what is happening with these trees, and maybe trick those pine boards to not invading a tree that's maybe stressed after wind or something like that? So we found out about the pheromones that are associated with the pine boards, and specifically the male or female pheromones and a variety of different species. 00:29:29:13 - 00:29:48:20 Speaker 2 And we're able to set up these, these traps that you would look at. The prevailing winds, traps would be set up. The pine pine board beetles would go into them, and you'd save a good amount of the trees in the area there. So that became a business that we did for about 3 or 4 years and, and then ended up selling that business afterwards. 00:29:48:22 - 00:30:07:10 Speaker 1 Is that is that the kind of technology, that kind of methodology that's used even now? I think of like after Hurricane Michael, that was like the biggest fear was, you know, the, you know, there's a certain, you know, degree at which it bends and afterwards, you know, it's too susceptible to those to those beetles. Is it still being used now? 00:30:07:12 - 00:30:24:00 Speaker 2 Honestly, I don't I mean, it obviously is a lot better than using diesel fuel, which is what the old school or old school was. And we I believe that it's still being used. I mean, I don't know, we can still get pheromones. I've talked to some folks out there. We actually were looking at a project here recently, and the gentleman was having some pine board issues. 00:30:24:00 - 00:30:39:06 Speaker 2 And so we ended up getting some pheromones for him. So it's a it's a tried and true technology that once the beetle gets to the spot where they leave the, the, if you will, the birth tree, they typically don't fly again. So they'll hit our trap, go in and they're done. 00:30:39:08 - 00:31:09:22 Speaker 3 Let's take a minute to talk about my friends at Sea and Shoreline. Since its inception in 2014, sea and shorelines unmatched experience with scientifically validated methods of aquatic restoration has proven successful across more than 150 environmental projects. The company continues to be the industry leader in rehabilitating threatened and corrupted aquatic environments, with proven success in places such as Crystal River, Homosassa River, the Caloosahatchee River, and the Indian River lagoon. 00:31:10:00 - 00:31:37:11 Speaker 3 I've seen firsthand how controlling completely reset the ecosystem and Crystal River, transforming from a mucky, algae dominated system to one with plants that actually belong there. The water used to be full of Libya and hydrilla, with a thick bottom layer of muck that smelled like rotten eggs, but with sea and shorelines, comprehensive muck removal, and planting of native eelgrass, the system is now beautiful, crystal clear, with lush eelgrass meadows. 00:31:37:16 - 00:32:02:06 Speaker 3 The manatees are feasting fish of returned. Eco tourism is booming and property values have significantly increased. Sea and shoreline is committed to restoring and preserving Florida's communities and aquatic ecosystems because they're Floridians and these are their communities to. To find out how you can partner with Sea and Drawing to help your community, visit them at WW and shoreline.com. 00:32:02:08 - 00:32:06:02 Speaker 3 You'll be glad you did. All right, back to the conversation. 00:32:06:04 - 00:32:26:22 Speaker 1 Let's let's shift over into politics, if you don't mind for a minute, talk about because in the midst of this, we're talking about all the, you know, your, your interest and everything is kind of bending into, into one direction, which is, you know, the environment. And then somewhere in there, because we haven't talked about it yet at all, which is why on earth would you want to be a member of the Florida House of Representatives? 00:32:26:22 - 00:32:29:02 Speaker 1 Like how how did this happen? 00:32:29:04 - 00:32:51:17 Speaker 2 So my dad and I had long conversations about politics. I grew up in Massachusetts as a Republican, which is interesting to say the least. I'm listening. A lot to to Rush Limbaugh and to Ronald Reagan was one of my, you know, big heroes. My mom, her big hero was was was JFK. And so learned a lot about leaders political environment. 00:32:51:18 - 00:33:23:12 Speaker 2 A dad and I had long discussions based on his military career, but also looking at and, and that type of thing I had always done in business was doing Leadership Florida. I worked with local leadership group, Chamber of Commerce, and all of a sudden I was working with some clients a couple different days. And these regulations that keep coming out well, this regulation of, you know, our comp plan here in Martin County or the the environmental regulations in Saint Lucie County or wherever, or Palm Beach, wherever it may be. 00:33:23:14 - 00:33:40:04 Speaker 2 I'm looking at these these regulations. I'm saying, you know, some of the stuff just doesn't make sense. What happens if this happens or what happens with that? Who wrote this stuff? And then, you know, then you get involved in the permitting for the water management district or for DEP or the Army Corps. Again, who the heck wrote this stuff? 00:33:40:04 - 00:34:00:10 Speaker 2 Or why is it taking so long? Why can't we have some different regulations that say X instead of Y? Yeah, so all of that led me to all right, well, who's making the decisions here? And that then said, well, if if I have an opportunity, I want to make those decisions and I want to be able to shape the future of these regulations, these regulations and the regulatory environment. 00:34:00:10 - 00:34:17:14 Speaker 2 So that's kind of how that was the driver to get me involved. Now, I had no idea really what the legislature was and the the beast that it can be. I was pretty naive going into it. I feel like I understand it a lot better now, but it was it was pretty again. I was pretty naive heading into it. 00:34:17:15 - 00:34:34:23 Speaker 1 What was that first race like? You know, where was like, hey, you got a little bit of an ax to grind, but but you're talking to a rather large districts here in Florida. So you're dealing with, you know, 200,000 people that you're trying to convince majority of them to let you do. How did you make that case for yourself? 00:34:35:01 - 00:34:54:06 Speaker 2 So that first race, my primary was, interesting. Is that a good word? We we had just come out of a lost summer here in the state of Florida or in Martin and Saint Lucie County. We had algae everywhere. There were major issues. People were really, really unhappy being an environmental consultant. I was doing a variety of different things. 00:34:54:08 - 00:35:16:07 Speaker 2 One of them was I was looking at composting and creating an area to deal, deal with waste, deal with human waste, and finding some ways to deal with that out West Town well and potentially creating biosolids mitigation, shall we say. Well, the other side in my primary got a hold of that. And next thing you know they're saying yeah, over. 00:35:16:07 - 00:35:39:00 Speaker 2 Dorf wants to dump, you know, 100,000 gallons of poop into your river and just see how, you know, just and and that was just a I mean, there were pictures of me with flies going around me and everything else, and it was it was interesting. And we were outraised two or 3 to 1, but was interesting also in that as I learned that negative campaign I literally had I had 2 to 3 mailers a day against me. 00:35:39:00 - 00:36:00:23 Speaker 2 I had radio against me, TV against me, smoke signals against me. I mean, you name it was against me. And I would walk. I would try to tie my walks and knocking on doors so that I would get there before the mail got there. And I'll never forget, I'm walking up and this lady's getting her mail out of her, out of her post box, and all of a sudden she takes it out and takes a look at that, looks at me and says, you're this guy. 00:36:01:03 - 00:36:19:14 Speaker 2 I said, yes, ma'am, I am, and ended up having a great conversation with her. And she says, I don't believe any of this stuff. And it turns out that the more negative they went, the more positive was coming back towards me because they were like, this guy can't be that bad, right? So I ended up winning that by about five points and never looked back from there. 00:36:19:14 - 00:36:38:04 Speaker 2 So and and made up with the people that were, were putting all the money against me and they basically looked back and said, you know, we had a really different impression of you. And that was that was, I think, the greatest thing to come out of that was being able to kind of prove some people wrong, who had a different understanding of who I was. 00:36:38:05 - 00:36:47:02 Speaker 1 Yeah. Talk about stepping in to the Capitol. You go to organizational session. You've just been elected. Had you been to Tallahassee before? 00:36:47:04 - 00:37:07:12 Speaker 2 I've been up there for fundraising and for for meeting some folks. I was there for leadership. Florida had done some, you know, some minor things here and there. We were there for, for for Joe Negron being sworn in. We I had done some fair amount of work with Ken Pruitt. Okay. Of course, Gail Harrell and Representative Snyder at the time, he then became Sheriff Snyder. 00:37:07:14 - 00:37:22:07 Speaker 2 So we had done a variety of work with them. So I'd been up there a couple of times, but nothing like being behind the scenes and having a access card that works and that type of thing that was that was really neat and actually having an office there. So when you start, of course, you're in the Tower of No Power up on the. 00:37:22:08 - 00:37:23:06 Speaker 2 I think I was in the you want. 00:37:23:06 - 00:37:40:10 Speaker 1 To describe that. Yeah. I mean the the Capitol has 22 floors and the new folks I mean, there are folks, state agencies and people that are in the, you know, the highest. And you get to the top level, which is just the overlook. But, you know, the the folks that just show up, it's the 11, 12, 13, 14 floors. 00:37:40:13 - 00:37:42:20 Speaker 1 And it's it's hard to get up there. 00:37:42:22 - 00:38:01:22 Speaker 2 It can be. Yeah. Most certainly. I mean, the elevators are quote unquote better now, but oftentimes and I was taking 14 flights of stairs down to meetings because you couldn't get on to an elevator and get down. And it's it was something that we became very tight, though as a freshman class, and many of us and we understood each other. 00:38:01:22 - 00:38:19:12 Speaker 2 And, it was it was a good time as well, because I learned how to work and I learned how to understand the regulations a lot more. And I'm one of those folks that I don't depend necessarily on the people around me all the time. I like to get into it. I like to read it. I like to understand, even today, I'll still open a statute book. 00:38:19:12 - 00:38:27:21 Speaker 2 I know everything's electronic, I get it, I know that, but I like having those books open in front of me so I can refer back and forth. I'm visual like that. 00:38:27:23 - 00:38:47:12 Speaker 1 I mean, talk about talk about cracking that. And it's not one book. It's a dozen or so books. And but you didn't just stick with environmental stuff. And you, I mean, you had and I want you to talk about it a little bit like the shark finning bill and things like that when you got there, but you're doing everything else as well, except for that. 00:38:47:12 - 00:39:00:23 Speaker 1 You've got to do public safety issues and you got to deal with insurance and education and all these things. Talk about what that was like in terms of like, was that something you were prepared going into? It was like, I'm going to have to get smart or smarter on these issues. 00:39:01:00 - 00:39:23:16 Speaker 2 I don't I don't care who you are. You are not prepared for that. That first year in Tallahassee and understanding and knowing the depth and breadth of knowledge that you then have to have in order to be able to vote on a variety of things, to have a comprehensive conversation. And if you're truly going to represent the people back home, you also need to understand how can you be of service to them as well. 00:39:23:16 - 00:39:41:15 Speaker 2 So here you are balancing the legislation that's coming in front of you, balancing all the variety of bills and things that are coming up in committee. Now. You're also understanding of the lobbyists that are out there and who's coming to your office every day or who's not. And then also understanding, all right, what are your compatriots working on? 00:39:41:17 - 00:40:00:04 Speaker 2 And all of that is thrown at you at the same time. And then. Oh, by the way, you still have to raise money for the next time if you're going to raise, even though you just got there. That's right. So all of those things, I think, taught me how to balance and also to deal with stress. I feel as though I'm a I'm a much better stress manager. 00:40:00:06 - 00:40:22:00 Speaker 2 After going through that process and understanding and being able to compartmentalize much more so and saying, all right, well, I can deal with this on at this point. I can deal with this at this point. You need to hold off over there. But I'm coming back to you in a little while and it works. The strategy that we've had, and I've been able to apply that in my professional business side, as well as the political side, and being able to balance all those different things. 00:40:22:02 - 00:40:42:10 Speaker 1 I mean, it's got to be hard, I guess, like the, I guess, the decent facts on like triaging or something like that in terms you can't possibly do everything that everyone's doing every day. You have committees that you are members of, and then there are committees that are doing work on, sometimes on bills that you're the sponsor of in places that you know that you are not. 00:40:42:14 - 00:40:51:04 Speaker 1 You know, as they're as they're discussing it. And so it's it's you can't possibly keep up with it all. And so the triaging must be it's interesting that the, the strategy came up with. 00:40:51:05 - 00:41:10:09 Speaker 2 Well, and you also have to you also end up trusting certain people. You have your, your confidants that you can say, all right, where are we on this? And tell me the tell me the truth on x, y, z, where do I need to be? And you come up with those certain folks that you really trust. You believe in them and they believe in you as well. 00:41:10:15 - 00:41:24:05 Speaker 2 And so, you know, when they tell you that the sky is blue, you don't have to look they the you you know, it is. And so you just move forward from that. And that trust is built a little bit over time. However, that's a that's a principal thing you have to have when you're up there. 00:41:24:06 - 00:41:45:01 Speaker 1 Yeah. Tell me about at that point and you mentioned it, you know, very, very briefly in passing is you served four terms in the House and you're running essentially all the time and it's two year term. And so you're always you always got to figure out, you know, how do you pay to get your message out to to your constituents in the meantime? 00:41:45:01 - 00:42:00:00 Speaker 1 What is the what is the secret? How do you go about the the process of, you know, getting your constituents to know and trust you, you know, to keep you back in, you know, every two years for four terms. 00:42:00:02 - 00:42:18:05 Speaker 2 Part of it, I, you know, I was blessed with very good staff. I worked with with a variety of staff members. Some of them are still in the process now. It's been really great to have have those folks around me. And they were some of them had been in the process a little bit, and some of them hadn't been in the process at all. 00:42:18:10 - 00:42:36:01 Speaker 2 So it's been it's been a good opportunity for me to then work through that process with them. They had connections back home, but what I always wanted to make sure I did, I meet with anybody. I'll meet with anybody at least once. If we have a good, respectful meeting. I don't care what side of the coin you're on, I'll. 00:42:36:05 - 00:42:51:16 Speaker 2 I'll continue the meeting if you disrespect and if you, you know, act like a buffoon, then you know it's. You're on your way. That being said, I think that had a lot to do with it. I will meet with anybody any time. And then if I said I was going to do something, I would follow through and get it done. 00:42:51:16 - 00:43:10:20 Speaker 2 I think that's one of the big things for back home. I was able to take a couple of concerns from back home, and I remember one gentleman, we were able to literally put his idea. I think it was a IT session was ending in March. He came to me in the middle of February and had this had this issue, we were able to put an amendment onto a bill. 00:43:10:20 - 00:43:26:15 Speaker 2 And then that bill was signed. Quite, you know, just just afterwards, he's never forgotten that we were able to take care of a situation. So that's a rarity. Don't get me wrong, that's a rarity, as you know. But doing those things I think really helped. And then, you know, I wrote some of my own bills and dealt with that. 00:43:26:16 - 00:43:47:10 Speaker 2 I mean, I dealt with those a deaf situation, you know, diesel exhaust fluid. And we were finding that diesel exhaust fluid was getting mixed with deicing on airports. And as a result, it was causing airplanes to crash and had done this in a couple of different times. But with my my wife being a corporate flight attendant, I didn't really feel all that good about it. 00:43:47:10 - 00:44:08:20 Speaker 2 It was very personal to me. So I wrote a bill that then eventually, after two years, was passed with almost unanimous. It's now now in law, but now it requires that death fluid is kept entirely separate from the deicing fluid and very well labeled when it's on an airport. And since that time, at least in Florida, we have not had any accidents whatsoever. 00:44:08:20 - 00:44:27:16 Speaker 2 But there were certainly some fatalities associated with that. And it's just one of those things that happened. But that was a bill that I had no lobbyists on whatsoever. It was just, you know, Toby right in the bill. And that's that's a neat experience. I got to be honest with you to be able to do that, and I didn't I didn't always have the bills that were the most popular, if you will. 00:44:27:17 - 00:44:29:18 Speaker 2 But we had bills that were impactful. 00:44:29:19 - 00:44:51:14 Speaker 1 No. And I think that's I think it's something that people I grew up with, friends of mine who are not anywhere near, you know, Tallahassee or their process don't understand is because everything is nationalized in terms of politics or public policy. And they don't realize that the the business and of what happens in your life really is that, you know, that city, county and state level, that's who's running it. 00:44:51:15 - 00:45:16:14 Speaker 1 I mean, that's where your life happens. And so I it's I think it's, you know, it's got to be really gratifying. Talk about some of those other things. You talked about those personal aspects or constituent aspects. A lot of people. Well, not a lot of you hear people say that because someone does something for a living, they should be somehow excluded from the conversation on the public sphere for that, for that subject. 00:45:16:14 - 00:45:45:16 Speaker 1 And what I mean is you're in the environmental business, you're inhabit environmental consultant. You're an expert in biology, marine biology, some zoology. It seems like you're one of the ideal people to be discussing, you know, laws surrounding mitigation, water quality, you know, aspects of your home. It is also in addition to that, you also live in a place that's very important and also very sensitive from an environmental standpoint in in River lagoon and the Saint Lucie estuaries. 00:45:45:20 - 00:46:07:19 Speaker 1 Like how do you how do you approach that in terms of and maybe educating your fellow legislators and maybe educating the public, and it may be the exact part of you working on things as we said, like that are the business end of making something better or correcting a problem that existed before. Sure, sure. 00:46:07:20 - 00:46:37:03 Speaker 2 I mean, I never really understood the philosophy of if you are a professional expert in a certain field, then you can't be a committee head for that particular field. I just didn't understand that. I respected the leadership, said, all right, it's your decision. It's not mine. So I ended up trying to work around it. That being said, I formed the South Florida Water Management District Caucus, which, I believe it or not, is one half of the Florida House and one half of the Florida Senate as well. 00:46:37:05 - 00:46:55:07 Speaker 2 That's how big the South Florida Water Management District area is, and we're able to educate members on that. And of course, we accepted others that were outside of the boundaries, but we were able to we had events at the water management District. We had at the house. We had some meetings on that, and it was I think it was a good educational component. 00:46:55:07 - 00:47:13:07 Speaker 2 So yes, what I, what I chose to do was to try to educate people about the issues rather than buck leadership and say, no, no, no, I have to do this or that. Right. And so I just you sometimes you have to choose your battles and all right, I'm going to go along with it. And as it progressed, I became an expert on bills. 00:47:13:07 - 00:47:27:23 Speaker 2 And people would come to me and ask me, all right, how do we how do we do this? Or how do we do that? Now the public might say, you know, here's a guy who's got an environmental and a environmental consulting firm, you know, what the heck? Why? Why should he be doing this? He's going to make money off of this. 00:47:28:00 - 00:47:55:03 Speaker 2 Well, there are a lot of parameters in which I would look at a bill and say, does this benefit only Toby and Toby's company, or is this a statewide regulation that's going to happen, right. Any time that there was even the missed or potentially of it only benefiting Toby Oberdorf, I wouldn't take a part in it. In fact, we had a couple of appropriations that came forward and our company was going to be doing the surveying on a certain road, and I said, I can't be a part of this. 00:47:55:03 - 00:48:08:09 Speaker 2 I can't, you know, I'm not going to be. And I actually and it was part of the general budget so I could then vote on it. But anything that was smaller than that, I couldn't vote on it. So that being said, I would always make sure that it was a general benefit across the entire state. 00:48:08:10 - 00:48:38:13 Speaker 1 And I don't think I think many people look at it from the outside and and there's a certain amount of cynicism, you know, that we that we carry is human beings and especially as Americans. And I think people assume that happens more than it does. And I don't think you're alone in that there. I think, you know, by and large, is 160 folks serving in the legislature that are actually rather, you know, very particular about, you know, not doing, you know, things that, you know, that benefit them, you know, specifically and directly. 00:48:38:14 - 00:48:56:04 Speaker 2 We have we have a big, strong conversation on ethics up there. Number one. Number two, my partners look at me here and say, are you crazy? You could be here making a crap time, money and being a part of this, and you're up there instead. And you're missing out on this charge ability or that project or whatever else. 00:48:56:04 - 00:49:18:12 Speaker 2 And I've always felt that that service was what I needed to do and be a part of that. So I'm not up there as a legislator to make money. I'm up there to, to make a difference. I know that sounds kind of corny, but I really I enjoyed that, I enjoyed, I've had several different people come to me and say, look, you did a bill on X, Y, Z, and it's really helped our family. 00:49:18:12 - 00:49:25:21 Speaker 2 And that is what I think will will pay dividends, not only from from that conversation, but for years and years and years to come. 00:49:25:23 - 00:49:51:16 Speaker 3 Let's take a minute to talk about my friends at Resource Environmental Solutions. Our state presents unique challenges with its diverse ecosystems, landscapes, and the many demands on its natural resources. That's why Rez uses an innovative approach and creative solutions to help municipalities, agencies and local water resource groups navigate the ever changing landscape of environmental regulations in Florida and throughout the country. 00:49:51:17 - 00:50:20:04 Speaker 3 Rez actively restores habitats, hydrological regimes, and ecosystem functions across Florida, from the Panhandle to the heartland to the Florida Keys, and everywhere in between. They focus on restoring floodplains and wetlands and improving water quality, which benefits a wide array of species that call Florida home. With an unwavering commitment to Florida's unique ecological communities, Rez upholds long term stewardship practices guaranteeing sustainable outcomes that endure. 00:50:20:06 - 00:50:33:09 Speaker 3 Discover more about their work and commitment to Florida's communities and the environmental challenges they face by visiting WWWRE dot U.S.. All right, now back to the conversation. 00:50:33:11 - 00:50:53:05 Speaker 1 Let's talk about those years and years and years to come. If you don't mind. And let's start with, I guess, the near present and future. And I've seen you, you know, I pay attention to these things. I think, you know, most people do, especially in a, you know, gubernatorial election year in a in a state like ours. And most of our, our governor served two terms. 00:50:53:05 - 00:51:27:20 Speaker 1 And so it doesn't happen very often. I've seen you out there working, talking about issues that are congruent with what the Byron Donalds campaign is looking at. How closely tied are you to those issues? He said some. I think for a lot of folks that do environmental things for a living, very exciting Coastal Court or I call it maybe the leave no region of the state behind, you know, in terms of, you know, the Saint Johns River, Indian River lagoon, you know, up in northwest Florida where you know, where my people are and, you know, Apalachicola and those, you know, wonderful estuaries and bays. 00:51:27:21 - 00:51:44:02 Speaker 1 How much are you dialed in to what that campaign is doing? And what is he? I mean, you know, we hear the sea, the speeches, and we see some of the documents, but what does that what is it going on in that campaign right now in terms of its approach to the environment? 00:51:44:04 - 00:52:04:18 Speaker 2 Well, I first have to give credit where credit is due, and that is to Maggie, who about three years ago, three and a half years ago looked at Byron and said, you're going to be our next governor. And I got on board very soon thereafter. And, and really, we I met Byron as a freshman. He was a sophomore in the Florida House, got to serve with him for a while. 00:52:04:20 - 00:52:35:17 Speaker 2 And he always had a perspective that looked at all of the issues. So we he invited me a couple of years ago to be a part of a water panel over on the West Coast, and was a part of it there, and we started to talk about a variety of regional issues and not just a one area, but but overall, and most recently, I've been asked to be to help out with some of the policy associated with his campaign and looking at a variety of different things that are associated with with Florida. 00:52:35:18 - 00:53:02:06 Speaker 2 Overall, I felt like I've been able to look at perspective from Pensacola to Key West and everywhere in between. So one of the things that we're we're really excited about, and I've had a great amount of opportunity to participate in, is the development of what we're calling the coastal corridor. Now, this is a expansion upon what the Fish and Wildlife folks have been doing in the and their foundation as well. 00:53:02:10 - 00:53:27:02 Speaker 2 They started the process where they're looking at a interconnection of coastal reefs and reef restoration across the entire state. However, this would actually now connect the wildlife corridor in the middle of the state to the coast, through our waterways, through everything else. And we're really looking now at a band that would have overall restoration. That would happen everywhere throughout our state and as well as conservation. 00:53:27:07 - 00:53:52:04 Speaker 2 Very excited about it, because again, this is an opportunity where it's it's nine miles offshore in the west on the west coast of Florida, three miles in the east coast of Florida, and then also going from the high tide line up into whether it be salt marshes, mosquito lagoons, potential other areas, parks, etc. that may in fact be donated or or a conservation easement could be put for a variety of these things there. 00:53:52:04 - 00:54:19:02 Speaker 2 So we're looking at nursery habitat for for a saltwater fish. We're looking at just quiet enjoyment. We're looking at preservation frankly, which is something that I'm very excited about again. And it's not going to be just one area versus another. We are crossing water district lines, D, P lines, county lines, etc. in order to achieve this goal. And this comprehensive plan is something that Congressman Donalds has been very strong part of. 00:54:19:03 - 00:54:40:13 Speaker 2 He wants to know the inner workings of things, and once he understands the process, he he will set of being an overlord, shall we say, in all of this stuff, he gets his trusted people around him and he says, go. And at that point in time, you start in those policies and you start working in his policies. And he has been just a great person to work with on these issues. 00:54:40:14 - 00:55:05:04 Speaker 2 You know, he has some very strong background in this as well, from his congressional time as well as the areas over Naples, Fort Myers that he's been working in. It's a it's a big issue there as well. So it's been great to work with him on that. The other part is we've looked at the environmental restoration we've been able to do in the Everglades, these large projects that have really just flourished under the leadership of governor DeSantis and the projects that have happened there. 00:55:05:04 - 00:55:29:10 Speaker 2 Now we're going to take the expertise that we've learned there, the expertise of these massively large projects, huge amount of money and being able to be successful with them. Why can't we apply that same principle across our state? Right. We have areas that this is so needed, whether it be the, you know, or whether in in the Saint John's, these are areas that absolutely need to have additional restoration activities. 00:55:29:13 - 00:55:45:00 Speaker 2 And so now we need to apply those things literally statewide. I mean, there's a lot of spring restoration we still need to work on. And so I think we're going to look at the same principles that we've done in the Everglades. Sure. Again, bring them outside of the the water management to the South Water District. 00:55:45:02 - 00:56:00:17 Speaker 1 And I think one is I think it's certainly a great approach. And as a, you know, Norfolk Island, I'm certainly in favor of of things where, you know, folks are paying attention to, to my neck of the woods. But I think there are a lot of places and it's not to take anything away at all from governor DeSantis. 00:56:00:18 - 00:56:24:17 Speaker 1 I mean, I think it's unqualified success in moving the ball forward on on the Everglades. But when you look at places like Indian River lagoon, Saint Johns River, Lake Okeechobee, you know, the spring system like hundreds and hundreds of clues. They haven't been ignored, you know, for by any stretch of the imagination or a lot of people that spend their entire lives and their careers are spent caring about and working at it. 00:56:24:17 - 00:56:41:13 Speaker 1 But the maybe the more that shift in focus in terms of, hey, let's approach this from, you know, a a designed end in mind, you know, for, for recovering, for restoring those places that are still kind of, you know, lagging behind. I think it's very interesting. 00:56:41:14 - 00:57:03:06 Speaker 2 And that's not to say that we aren't looking at finishing a job, per se. And the Everglades, I mean, that does something that has to continue. We need to keep working there, but we're going to just basically utilize some of the lessons we've learned there and apply it, imply it elsewhere. One other item that we're also looking at is there's been a fair amount of deferred maintenance that's happened with all the different districts. 00:57:03:08 - 00:57:20:14 Speaker 2 This is not a sexy topic by any means. You know, it really isn't. But when you all of a sudden have ankle deep water in places you shouldn't and it's because a structure has failed. That's a major issue. And we need to be making sure that we take care of those structures. We take care of that deferred maintenance. 00:57:20:14 - 00:57:41:21 Speaker 2 And if that's across every single water management district right now, and those are areas that that we're going to have to deal with those contamination issues that have been lingering. I mean, in my profession, we do phase one and phase two environmental assessments, and we have some projects where you look back and there's contamination that's been on a particular site for 35. 00:57:41:22 - 00:58:00:12 Speaker 2 40 years and hasn't been closed out. Why why do we have to continue to wait to close these out? Why can't we get this done and get it off the books? Whether it's for the real estate value, whether it's for the the overall taught value, we need to make sure that these areas are cleaned up and we can we can move forward with this. 00:58:00:12 - 00:58:16:14 Speaker 2 There's no reason to have that. Another area we're looking at is as updating potentially our databases and how we search our database. I mean, Oculus system is is an art to get through, shall we say. There are certain people that can get through it and there are certain that can't. 00:58:16:16 - 00:58:18:23 Speaker 1 It's like finger painting for me when I do it. 00:58:19:00 - 00:58:50:09 Speaker 2 The I mean, South Florida, Saint Johns, etc. they have great databases. We're able to look at historical records. So again, these aren't necessarily sexy topics, but they're needed topics that then allow us to then on the regulatory side to move forward on a much faster basis so that that cost that everyone has. We talk about affordability, so much of our cost, and we look at it now, and the congressman has said this to Congressman Donalds, that 30% of any of any construction for new homes is in permitting and in government costs. 00:58:50:11 - 00:58:57:01 Speaker 2 We need to be able to reduce that. And I think that's something I'm very excited to potentially be able to have an opportunity to work on. 00:58:57:03 - 00:59:16:20 Speaker 1 It is very exciting. Now, let me get to you a little more personally is this campaign will come to an end. You're you're a guy that you know, you've decided to serve, and that's what you've been doing for for eight years now. My sense is that you're not done with, you know, the public sphere, not done in trying to figure out what that service looks like. 00:59:16:21 - 00:59:31:18 Speaker 1 Are you looking at future? You know, I know I'm asking a terrible question. It's like, but are you looking at the, you know, the future of staying involved in, you know, the the state, you know, state arena, the state politics, state public service in the future. 00:59:31:20 - 01:00:01:02 Speaker 2 If I'm called to serve, I would certainly look at that. And I love the opportunity to be able to to serve within this next administration, if that, if that comes up in whatever capacity that is and deem fit. If not, I'll certainly probably run for office again and and get going there. But I feel as though there's some great opportunities for me to be able to utilize the knowledge, the experience, the conglomeration of the different things that I've been through that would allow me then to serve the people of Florida. 01:00:01:08 - 01:00:14:09 Speaker 1 There's some good new talent out there in terms of legislators that you're leaving behind their newer ones. What what advice do you offer them now? You know, is you're kind of in the position that you are now, which is you're still you're still a representative. 01:00:14:13 - 01:00:15:20 Speaker 2 Emeritus, right. 01:00:15:21 - 01:00:37:02 Speaker 1 Is there something that you're like, gosh, if I had had another year, if I had another two years, I definitely would have, you know, brought this forward. Is there something that sits out there that you're like where you're trying to get into your successors ear or someone else and say, and maybe it is, you know, Congressman Donald's in a, you know, the prospective administration is like, gosh, this would be you should write this law. 01:00:37:03 - 01:00:37:10 Speaker 1 Well. 01:00:37:10 - 01:00:57:13 Speaker 2 I look at our our state parks currently, and I think that there are some state parks that are donor parks and there are others that that are not. And the donor parks sometimes actually suffer because a lot of their financial resources go out of that area and go into those areas that that can't raise a lot of attendance. 01:00:57:15 - 01:01:18:09 Speaker 2 So I think we need to figure out a fix for for that. I mean, in my backyard here is Jonathan Dickinson State Park, and we have a tower there that has not been reconstructed and was deemed unsafe years ago. And yet, here's one of the most popular parks. But we can't get this tower reconstructed. So I think this is something that we have to look at of how we manage our parks. 01:01:18:09 - 01:01:43:06 Speaker 2 The the exotic vegetation is something that irks me to to no end, and we have to find ways to deal with the management, exotic vegetation as well as our regular vegetation. I think we need to do a fair amount of controlled burns across the entire state. So those are some things that I would look at from. I don't know if it's necessarily in a legislative part or an appropriations part, but I think those are some things that that I'd love to get back into. 01:01:43:08 - 01:02:05:10 Speaker 2 There are some fisheries issues, whether it be with with bait fish on menhaden and things like that, where we're seeing in other areas in the United States that that bait fish is being collected and taken by, by foreign interests and therefore our own, our own fisheries are being impacted as a result. And we're even seeing a decline up north in osprey populations as a result. 01:02:05:10 - 01:02:24:12 Speaker 2 So I think that that's another area that I'd like to look at as a legislator, how can we protect the state of Florida a little bit more? Obviously, I would look at contamination issues. I mean, is there so many items in the environmental space I would look at, you know, outside of that, obviously I've always done work on human trafficking and things like that. 01:02:24:16 - 01:02:30:05 Speaker 2 That's been an area that both my wife and I have worked on extremely hard. And so that that job is never done. 01:02:30:07 - 01:02:44:11 Speaker 1 I want to let that I'm going to let that go in and drift off and wait for the to be continued part of that to pop up. So I'm looking forward to seeing what, what that looks like and, and what you get after here in the days and years to come. Thank you. I'm going to jump to the standard questions. 01:02:44:11 - 01:03:01:18 Speaker 1 And you've heard him before. I'm going to switch it up a little bit because I want to, you know, because of your your emeritus status. But I do want to ask you the first one, which is, I think the most important one that I have, which is really, you know, are you optimistic about the future of Florida's environment, its natural systems, and then why? 01:03:01:20 - 01:03:22:15 Speaker 2 I'm extremely optimistic. Here's a you're talking to a person that my first day in Florida was probably one of the worst days for many people in Florida, being the day after Hurricane Andrew. And at that time we had the Kissimmee River, which was straight. We had an Everglades system which was failing. We had water going where it's not supposed to go in the water where it was supposed to go wasn't going there. 01:03:22:15 - 01:03:42:00 Speaker 2 And the Florida Bay was dying. We have a completely different system now that's under repair. There are there are some groups out there that say, we haven't done anything, and I would challenge that wholeheartedly. We have done a lot of work, and I really look forward to the future of Florida and what that environment has for it, or what we have for that environment. 01:03:42:00 - 01:04:07:18 Speaker 2 I think that we are on the right track and now we need to learn the lessons, like I said, of South Florida, apply that statewide. And I think that, you know, with Congressman Donald's strategy of looking at a coastal corridor and this large preservation combined with what we did under the DeSantis administration for not only Everglades, but also the inner corridor and the wildlife core that we created there, I think that the future is certainly bright for Florida. 01:04:07:20 - 01:04:19:07 Speaker 2 I would also suggest that we continue to and with President Trump's review, we have an offshore ban on all drilling. I think we continue with those those items as well. 01:04:19:12 - 01:04:40:10 Speaker 1 And then kind of I break the last one into into two parts. First, I want to give you a chance to give your best advice for a young person that's out there looking to find their shark cage to inadvisable get into with great white sharks or the environmental field writ large, I want you to give your best advice to that person in terms of moving forward. 01:04:40:10 - 01:05:03:17 Speaker 1 And then I want you to give your best advice to somebody who wants to jump into what you did, which is that environmental kid that's out there right now and making their way professionally and then decides that, hey, maybe I should, you know, if Toby Oberdorf can do this, maybe I can go, you know, and make my case, you know, with another 120, the other 119 people, you know, in the Florida House as well. 01:05:03:19 - 01:05:27:00 Speaker 2 You know, one of the things you have to do is get off the couch and put your phone away. Those are you do those things and you start showing up. That is that's a major part of this whole game. Get out and walk in the park and and get outside and spend some time in nature. Understand if you take a back to Carl George, he said, if you know everything about one thing, you'll know everything about everything. 01:05:27:02 - 01:05:45:14 Speaker 2 And so the way I took that was, if you understand, a blade of grass and its root systems, that cellular technology, it's, it's, it's chemical makeup, how other things in the atmosphere might affect that, how the sunlight might affect it. All of a sudden you're going down this rabbit hole where you have a gazillion different items that are affecting this. 01:05:45:14 - 01:06:05:11 Speaker 2 So I would suggest that you start to be curious about one thing, and you'll start to learn about everything that is that is associated with it. As far as those folks that are wanting to get into the the legislative world or the world out there again, get involved, understand, don't just follow along. As Ronald Reagan said, trust, but verify. 01:06:05:15 - 01:06:25:21 Speaker 2 And I know he was talking about nuclear and everything else. But as you as you look at process, trust that what you're being told is there. But then go out and verify it for yourself. You may have a little bit of a different hinge on on what is happening out there. And then always try to experience new things is something that that I've put out there. 01:06:25:23 - 01:06:42:07 Speaker 2 I'm in my late 50s now, and I will still try and go and do new things, experience new things and why not? I mean, we have one life to live here on in this world, and that's one of the things that my wife and I try to do is always to try to experience new things. 01:06:42:09 - 01:06:48:11 Speaker 1 I think that's a tremendous advice. And Toby Oberdorf can't thank you enough for spending some time with me. 01:06:48:14 - 01:07:03:20 Speaker 2 It's always it's always a pleasure. I enjoy this most, most all of the time. Some questions that put me up against the wall, which are which are great, which is good. And I'm glad you make people feel uncomfortable. Because if you're not, if you're always comfortable, you're not learning. And you need to make sure that we're uncomfortable at times. 01:07:03:22 - 01:07:05:05 Speaker 1 Appreciate you being a good sport. 01:07:05:06 - 01:07:06:12 Speaker 2 Thank you so much. 01:07:06:14 - 01:07:29:06 Speaker 3 Well, that's it for this episode. Thanks for listening to water for fighting. And thank you once again, Torres, and seeing shoreline for making it possible. If you're enjoying the show, please be sure to subscribe on whatever platform you use. And don't forget to leave a five star rating and review. You can follow the show on LinkedIn and Instagram at Ethel Water Pod, and you can reach me directly at Ethel Water pod@gmail.com. 01:07:29:11 - 01:07:49:13 Speaker 3 Send me your comments and suggestions for who and or what you'd like to know more about production. This podcast is by Lonely Fox Studios. Thanks to Carl Soren for making the best of what he had to work with, and in David Barfield for the amazing graphics and technical assistance. A very special thank you goes out to Bo Spring from the Bo Spring Band for giving permission to use his music for the podcast. 01:07:49:16 - 01:08:04:21 Speaker 3 The song is called Doing Work for free and you should check out the band live or ever. Great music is sold. Join me next time for another amazing conversation with someone who has helped shape water and environmental policy in the Sunshine State. Until then, keep your whiskey close and your water closer.